An Answerless Question, Sonnetary Options

[jgdittier]

His picture placed upon the page appears.
How  poignant be his smile, forever gone.
He's served our cause, he's earned our honest cheers,
But yesterday, he saw his final dawn.
We lose each day a man, like he, or more,
A hero, he, who ne'er can be replaced.
It's he, the price we pay in ev'ry war.
In human terms, the loss too great a waste.*
*this is the thought addressed in the closing couplet

Were he not there, we'd still have slavery.
Were he not there, our arms would rise with "Heil!"
Were he not there, there be no bravery.
Were he not there, there'd be no life worthwhile.

With but this thought no cause can earn its keep.
Can e'er the cost of freedom be too steep?

[Guest_Toumai_*]

Dear Ron

A wonderful sentiment so well expressed. If only we all, worldwide, thought more about life and our responsibilities we wouldn't need to loose young men - and women - so painfully.

Fran

[Guest_Jox_*]

Hi Ron,

Well done.

A personal response:

The cost of freedom can, indeed, be very high. Sitting here in my comfortable existence I can easily say I'm not sure it can be too high. (Because without freedom what have we? Mind you, what is freedom?) But if I were fighting the Nazis I might not be so smug.

However, the latest war that the USA and UK seem Hell-bent on prosecuting seems to have very little to do with freedom as far as many of us can see. I support our militaries themselves but feel that the Bush and Blair administrations are throwing thousands of lives on the scrap heap for no reason of freedom at all. And I find that all sorts of things - but ultimately very sad indeed.

Thanks for your excellent reminder, Ron.

J.

[Guest_Nina_*]

Hi Ron

Well done for raising the question and putting it so well.  

We pay a very high price for war.  Is it too high? Not an easy question to answer.  In the case of the Nazis - no.  Hitler murdered far more innocent people and had to be stopped.  However with the Iraq war, the price (in my opinion) was too high.  The motive was not freedom but power and money.

Were he not there, there be no bravery.
Were he not there, there'd be no life worthwhile.

I can't agree with you on these two lines.  There are many brave people in the world who do not fight wars yet show great courage in other ways.

Would life be worthwhile without there having been war? Again with the Iraq war the answer is yes.

Very thought provoking, thanks

Nina

[jgdittier]

DEar All,
I will admit to some PL, most obviously the slavery/bravery rhyme. I've often postulated with a nephew history teacher what would have been the outcome if Lincoln had let the South go in peace. I believe it would shortly have died its own death.  Lincoln really fought that war to keep the union intact. Perhaps that was justification enough.
RE Iraq, only time will tell.
I believe  Christianity has had a 600year head start on Islam and were we go go back into history, we'd see the parallel more clearly.
Cheers,    Ron   jgd

[Guest_poeticpiers_*]

christianity sprang from judaism and islam sparng from christianity and each in turn seems to have lost the original message they once had.Religious wars both past and present those in volved make the claim they are fighting Gods cause.
I dont recall in any religios book the commandment to slay unbelievers.

[jgdittier]

Dear Ivor,
This is one of my personal favorites among my own work. Yet it treats lightly so much that is apparently beyond man's wisdom to solve.
I made four statements some of which were intended more for feel than for strict interpretation.
re slavery, I believe some troops fought to free the slaves, but had Lincoln let the South go in peace, slavery would soon have died as it was economically unsustainable and although man makes his moral progress slowly, goodness would have overcome
re Hitler, we would be so saluting
re bravery, that is nonsense, a convenient rhyme
re freedom, there are some who would prefer to live as serfs in the dark ages, sheep under an evil shepherd, but I think on the whole, man is inspired by calls to freedom and
the memorable words of Patrick Henry and Thomas Paine and that freedom is as heavenly a concept as love.
Those who find a justification to oppose war never seem to offer a practical means to do so without paying the price for "peace" with freedom. Short of the David/Goliath very, very temporary solution, how should perceived good deal with perceived evil?
Is it true that "no cause can earn its keep"? It is that line that I like so.
No need for response. This one should float off the board gracefully.
Cheers, Ron jgd

[Aphrodite]

Hello Ron,

This is such a compelling piece written with conviction and passion.
At what cost do we suffer and lose lives for supposed freedom?

"Were he not there, we'd still have slavery.
Were he not there, our arms would rise with "Heil!"
Were he not there, there be no bravery.
Were he not there, there'd be no life worthwhile."

This stanza is especially strong in how you communicate a timeline! Your poem makes me dig deep for a plausible reason to justify such agony and loss in war, but I am left shaking my head in horror.

Thought provoking and honest!

Lindi

[JustDaniel]

Greetings, Ron. I see that I'm a bit late in visiting this. I am slow at times, ya know. Now, please explain your word 'sonnetary' for me, would you? This looks like some kind of sonnet to me (though I would place that *explanation at the END of the poem rather than in the middle. It threw me for a loop, and I tried to fit it into the rhythm! )

I see that many have noted their own perspective growing out of their pondering, and of course I cannot agree with some of them... but this is not the place for that discussion, methinks.


deLighting in the interchange, as always, Daniel

P.S. Ron, I edited out my 'crit' and sent it to you in PM. Honestly, after doing several crits in the other forum, I ventured over here and proceded to forget where I was! I certainly meant no dishonor... and I clearly see why this might be your own favorite piece!

[Cleo_Serapis]

Sorry Daniel but this is our NON CRIT forum.

I take sonnetary to mean sonnet-like...

Can you please edit your reply (you could PM Ron your thoughts - I'm sure he'd be OK with it).

Please keep that in mind for future reference.

Lori

[Cleo_Serapis]

Hi Ron.

It's so refreshing to read your poetry again! I admire those who write sonnets, I find the parameters too complex.


His picture placed upon the page appears.
How poignant be his smile, forever gone.
A good opening couplet - and sad, grabbing my attention.

He's served our cause, he's earned our honest cheers,
But yesterday, he saw his final dawn.
Well expressed Ron!

We lose each day a man, like he, or more,
A hero, he, who ne'er can be replaced.
It's he, the price we pay in ev'ry war.
In human terms, the loss too great a waste.
How truly sad - you've pulled me in and grabbed my heartstrings.

Were he not there, we'd still have slavery.
Were he not there, our arms would rise with "Heil!"
Were he not there, there be no bravery.
Were he not there, there'd be no life worthwhile.
Freedom - let it shine through and be celebrated!

With but this thought no cause can earn its keep.
Can e'er the cost of freedom be too steep?
A great ending Ron - loss of life is certainly too steep, but a necessary act (unfortunately, warring has been going on since our dawn of time).

Enjoyed!
~Cleo