Life and Death In The Pub With No Name, A poem Options

[Guest_Jox_*]

© James Oxenholme, 2005. I, James Oxenholme, do assert my right to be identified as the author of this work in accordance with Sections 77 and 78 of The Copyrights, Designs And Patents Act, 1988. (Laws of Cymru & England, as recognised by international treaties). This work was simultaneously copyrighted in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America. This work is posted as an unpublished work in order to elicit critical assistance and other helpful comment, only.

Revised version - thanks Alan, Nina and Fran.
A note for Grace - This is Real or Imagined (or was that the wrong Boolean Operator? (sorry Grace!) :) ).



Ref: PF 0316 AE

Life & Death In
The Pub With No Name
by PF

My friend sat across
the table from me,
hunched-forward
in discomfort,
bordering on agony.

My back's bad:
I lift things poorly -
may have damaged
stomach muscles.
I actually think
it’s something worse.

I feel nauseous;
I have stabbing pains;
I feel terrible.

I sympathised;
I empathised;
I related all my ills.

I told him how they
stick a camera down.
Uncomfortable,
though painless;
he was terrified.

We agreed -
we were falling apart.
Positive entropy:
felt negative to us.

But he had more...
At night I wake up,
unable to breathe.
Each time death is
checking his watch.

It didn’t worry me -
before we had children.
I don’t want to die
in my sleep, simply
forgetting to breathe -
wouldn’t be fair on them.

We had another drink,
told a few dirty jokes,
watched the snow fall
against the pub’s windows
and passed the time of day.

Death stood too close,
tapping his watch:
ready to call time.

(end)

------------------------------------
AD to AE was a very minor revision:

[color=darkred]I lift things awkwardly -
may have damaged
{my} stomach muscles

-------------------------------------

Ref: PF 0316 AC

Life & Death In
The Pub With No Name
by PF

My friend sat across
the table from me,
hunched-forward
in discomfort,
bordering on agony.

My back: it’s bad,
I lift things awkwardly -
may have damaged
my stomach muscles.
I actually think
it’s something worse.

I feel nauseous;
I have stabbing pains;
I feel terrible.

I sympathised;
I empathised;
I told him how they
stick a camera down.

I related all my ills;
we agreed -
we were falling apart.
Positive entropy:
felt negative to us.

But he had more...
At night I wake up,
unable to breathe.
Each time death is
checking his watch.

It didn’t worry me -
before we had children.
I don’t want to die
in my sleep, simply
forgetting to breathe -
wouldn’t be fair on them.

We had another drink,
told a few dirty jokes,
watched the snow fall
against the pub’s windows
and passed the time of day.

Death stood in the corner,
tapping his watch.


(end)

-----------------------------------------------

Ref: PF 0316 AB

Life & Death in
The Pub With No Name
by PF

My friend sat across
the table from me,
hunched-forward
in discomfort,
bordering on agony.

It’s my back, he said:
because it’s bad I lift
things in a strange way -
so now it might be my
stomach muscles.
Though I actually think
it’s something worse.

I feel nauseous;
I have stabbing pains;
I feel terrible.

I sympathised;
I empathised;
I told him how they
stick a camera down.

I related all my ills;
we agreed -
we were falling apart.
Positive entropy:
felt negative to us.

But he had more...
At night I wake up,
unable to breathe.
Each time death is
checking his watch.

It didn’t worry me -
before we had children.
I don’t want to die
in my sleep, simply
forgetting to breathe -
wouldn’t be fair on them.

We had another drink,
told a few dirty jokes,
watched the snow fall
against the pub’s windows
and passed the time of day;
before we both died.

(end)

[Guest__*]

Dear Jox,

Taken to its logical conclusion, well done !

So our March meet is off, huh ?

I know you've set this as a poem, but it reads more like prose to me, and very good prose too. Whether it is a very good poem will emerge as we all discuss it.

Since there is now no further possibility of your amending it, don't suppose there is any point in offering crit and suggestion ....

Just kidding !

My friend sat across -- Across the table, my friend sat, hunched forward ....
the table from me,
hunched-forward
in discomfort, -- in A discomfo ... ? no comma
bordering on agony.

It’s my back, he said:
because it’s bad I lift
things in a strange way -
so now it might be my
stomach muscles.
Though I actually think -- Del though ?
it’s something worse.

I feel nauseous;
I have stabbing pains; -- and stabbing pains
I feel terrible.             -- make me feel ter ... ?

I sympathised;
I empathised;
I told him how they -- del I, use and ?
stick a camera down.

I related all my ills; -- related a very fancy word here - I told him all my ills ?
we agreed -
we were falling apart. -- both falling apart - there are too many I and we near each other !
Positive entropy: -- no colon, poss a dash ?
felt negative to us.

But he had more... -- Jox, this verse is confusing - make it clearer HE is talking
At night I wake up, -- also Ithink tenses need rejigging ?
unable to breathe.
Each time death is
checking his watch.

It didn’t worry me -  -- ditto HIM
before we had children.
I don’t want to die
in my sleep, simply
forgetting to breathe -
wouldn’t be fair on them.

We had another drink,
told a few dirty jokes,
watched the snow fall
against the pub’s windows
and passed the time of day;
before we both died. -- before odd choice. Simpler "then" ? Omit "Both" ?


Jox, as I've worked through this, the logical continuance strikes me as so correct, what else IS there to do after parading all one's ills - shuffle off !

Hope some of my ideas revive you enough for our March meet, btw how is that going ?

Love
Alan

[Guest__*]

Dear Jox,

Just thought of an alt title :

IN SICKNESS AND IN PUB

as opposed to "in health" ?

Love
Alan

[Guest_Jox_*]

Thanks, Alan..

>>So our March meet is off, huh ?

Hi Alan... Thanks for the reminder but I haven’t forgotten - just been busy.
I shall post the final details tomorrow (or today if I have the time).

>>Taken to its logical conclusion, well done !

I don’t quite know how to take that! Shall I thank you? (at least on others’ behalf?)

>>I know you've set this as a poem, but it reads more like prose to me, and very good prose too. Whether it is a very good poem will emerge as we all discuss it.

Thanks, Alan. As I wrote this it crossed my mind that it was another very close poem / prose thing. However, in the middle I have two verses starting with “I” throughout which I used to relate the tw characters to each other. That would not make prose. Since the poem pivots on those two verses I opted for poetry - but I agree with you; close thing.

>>Since there is now no further possibility of your amending it, don't suppose there is any point in offering crit and suggestion .... Just kidding !

And thanks for your extensive crit...

“My friend sat across -- Across the table, my friend sat, hunched forward ....
“the table from me,
“hunched-forward
“in discomfort, -- in A discomfo ... ? no comma
“bordering on agony.

I’ve spent the last five minutes saying this and I think I’ll keep the comma, thanks. My reasoning is thus: I wanted to slow the gap between the two lines. To say “discomfort” and let that sink in. Then to throw-in “agony.” I nearly set that last line on its own but felt that would be too long. So the comma is there to increase the pause.

“Though I actually think -- Del though ?

Thanks - being deleted.

“I feel nauseous;
“I have stabbing pains; -- and stabbing pains
“I feel terrible. -- make me feel ter ... ?

“I sympathised;
“I empathised;
“I told him how they -- del I, use and ?
“stick a camera down.

Ah Sorry I should have read down first! As I said above, these verses are the pivot of the poem. Without these it would be prose just about. However, I’m not keeping them to make it a poem - such would be daft. I wanted to establish a symmetry of conversation between the two characters. As if they were mirror-images in a way. So I set the conversations personal but reflective of each other.

I related all my ills; -- related a very fancy word here - I told him all my ills ?
we agreed -
we were falling apart. -- both falling apart - there are too many I and we near each other !
Positive entropy: -- no colon, poss a dash ?
felt negative to us.

Related - fancy? Don’t get that... It’s how I talk normally and I don’t talk “fancy.” I prefer to use one word instead of two wherever possible (and then write millions of them! - I said it before anyone else could.)

Thanks for the mention of “falling apart,” ‘tis a cliche I’d not spotted. However, it is reported speech so I think it works but I shall think carefully about it. As regards too many we-s - it was a pub! Seriously, thanks for the pointer - I’ll chop one “we.”

The entropy thing - again, I’ve just spent a while saying that. And I’m unsure. I like a colon because it keeps the pace slower. Also the second part explains the first (therefore should be a semi-colon). A dash would probably work but might speed it up too much. This one’s still under consideration, thanks.

But he had more... -- Jox, this verse is confusing - make it clearer HE is talking
At night I wake up, -- also Ithink tenses need rejigging ?

Thanks Alan. I did wonder about the confusion between I and he. When there is only one speaker it’s fine but here it does confuse. (I was too close to tell). I don’t like quotes cluttering-up poetry, unless really necessary. This poem would be awash with them. So I’ll take your advice and differentiate (“make it clear,“ as you rightly say). I have decided to do that using a font differentiation. Thanks very much - this did worry me.

We had another drink,
told a few dirty jokes,
watched the snow fall
against the pub’s windows
and passed the time of day;
before we both died. -- before odd choice. Simpler "then" ? Omit "Both" ?

I agree the last line fails (especially as I didn’t quite mean that). What I meant to say was just getting on with life pending death, not that we pegged it  then and there. I have a very different ending, thanks to your prodding.

>>Jox, as I've worked through this, the logical continuance strikes me as so correct, what else IS there to do after parading all one's ills - shuffle off !

OK, I’ll go then!

>>Just thought of an alt title : IN SICKNESS AND IN PUB as opposed to "in health" ?

Very good, thanks.

A couple of reasons to stick, though...

1. I Can’t stand Johnny Speight’s comedies (“In Sickness..“ was the title of the sequel to the Alf Garnet sitcom) - although I know it is a much older phrase. Rather too “London” for my language, too.

2. “The Pub With No Name,” is meant to reflect the anonymous aspect of just two middle-aged codgers musing over ills - they have no name, the pub doesn’t. But, of course, the pub is still likely to outlast them.

And some real background...

3. That is the name of the pub we were in yesterday when this morose, but fairly accurately-reported, conversation took place. (My friend, A has even just sold his Escort XR3i to try to hang on to his coil a little longer for his children’s sake - he received two ‘phone calls, whilst we chatted,  from potential buyers who were a day too late. Anyway, at fifty-one he‘s five years older than I, so it is time for him to stop being a boy racer he thinks). It’s the same pub I dubbed “The Royal Oak” in my January poem (MB 0261 - which has been critted on MM and remains here in Freeform if anyone wishes to look). It has two names “The White Horse” and “The pub with No Name” as its pub sign-holders have no board in them - looking like a skeletal reminder of past glories. “The Good Pub Guide” only goes to two stars now but when it did three stars, this pub was one of only two in the UK to receive those three stars. It is 15th Century and will certainly out-last my friend and I.

[Guest__*]

Dear Jox,

I took your words to be much more surreal than you meant - that's why I said the logical thing, having discussed all one's illnesses, undeed, swapped them, is to go the distance and shuffle off.

If you did not mean they died NOW, I do think you'dd need to rewrite.

As to the rest, I get your reasoning, even if I (obviously) don't agree with it all. If you go for different fonts, that will work in print, but would it spoken ? I suppose one could do 2 voices ?

I understand about the I I I  being the hub of the poem, but I still think too many of them lined up makes for a distraction when reading. Perhaps you could make it even more I I I , to show that it is deliberate.

As the man said, one murder, you're a criminal, millions, you're a world stateman, so either add more I to make it a feature, or find a way to reduce the body-count !

You could also do I v he, as reported speech ?

Keep working on it, as usual you have come up with an off-the-pub-wall concept !

Love
Alan

[Guest_Jox_*]

Hi Alan,

Thanks again.

Many of your kind suggestions have been adopted and other issues which you raised, addressed.

I think your post and my revision posting crossed. I have changed the font colours. If read aloud, yes two voices (one actor would be fine).

I'm not sure about your comment on the "I"s in those middle verses - because all the lines do begin with "I," (as I think you suggest) save the last which is a direct continuation of the penultimate. I hope that looks deliberate.

>>As the man said, one murder, you're a criminal, millions, you're a world statesman, so either add more I to make it a feature, or find a way to reduce the body-count !

So let's elect Tony again - we can make him a World statesman with 3-4 more years of the Bush-Blair ticket.

>>You could also do I v he, as reported speech ?

With the re-write (AB to AC) based upon your comments, I have actually dispensed with one example of that because the font colour now does it for me.

>>If you did not mean they died NOW, I do think you'd need to rewrite.

Agreed and I have re-written the ending. Cue "Mr Death - a little man from the village, come to do the Reaping," as Monty Python has him.

>>Keep working on it, as usual you have come up with an off-the-pub-wall concept !

Well, I thank you but this is actually one of my more grounded (floored?) poems methinks. Of course, we could have the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse doing a strip-tease in the other bar, whilst the Purple Ferret Band played "Waltzing Matilda" in the corner and Margaret Thatcher brought Blood Milk-Shakes ("on the house, darling") round for us all to drink. That's more my natural style. And it gives me a great idea for something...

Thanks, Alan. James.

[Guest_Nina_*]

Hi James

You must have been listening into a conversation with my mother-in-law.  She is 84 and all she wants to talk about is her aches and pains and how she might not be long for this world.  It is just a shame that I don't get the drink and dirty jokes thrown in as well.

Seriously though.  I had a quick read earlier and I like the revisions you have already made, especially to the last line.  Previously it seemed as if their death happened while they were sitting there (or else their jokes were so bad they died).  Now it ties in nicely with the earlier verse:

At night I wake up,
unable to breathe.
Each time death is
checking his watch.
When reading this, it seems as if he is being over dramatic, then by the end of the poem, you realise it is prophetic.

Just a couple of observations

My friend sat across
the table from me,
hunched-forward
in discomfort,
bordering on agony.
I agree with you that you need at least a comma after discomfort, does it give enough of a pause?


My back: it’s bad,
I lift things awkwardly - I lifted things awkwardly
may have damaged
my stomach muscles.
I actually think
it’s something worse.


I sympathised;
I empathised;
I told him how they
stick a camera down.

I related all my ills;
we agreed -
we were falling apart.
Positive entropy:
felt negative to us.

The line - I told him how they stick a camera down - feels wrong.  Either you could leave it out all together:

I sympathised;
I empathised;
I related all my ills.

We agreed -
we were falling apart.
Positive entropy:
felt negative to us.

or

I sympathised;
I empathised;
I related all my ills.
I told him how they
stick a camera down.

We agreed -
we were falling apart.
Positive entropy:
felt negative to us.

Please leave the aches and pains at home when we all meet up and just bring along the dirty jokes.  I could do with a laugh (and a few drinks)

Just editing to add that I think related works well in this verse.  It is a word I often use, infact I was just typing it now on something which reminded me that I wanted mention it.
Nina

[Guest_Toumai_*]

Hi James,

Well, some of us can look forward to the enjoyment of discussing (or disgusting?) our sore points in the pub in a few weeks time.

One (tentative - as always) suggestion:

Death stood in the corner,
tapping his watch.

Time gentlemen, please.

Cheers!

Fran

[Guest_Jox_*]

Hi Nina,

>>You must have been listening into a conversation with my mother-in-law. She is 84 and all she wants to talk about is her aches and pains and how she might not be long for this world. It is just a shame that I don't get the drink and dirty jokes thrown in as well.

LOL. You’ll have to modify her conversations... to include the dirty jokes - and give her a drink!

>>Seriously though. I had a quick read earlier and I like the revisions you have already made, especially to the last line. Previously it seemed as if their death happened while they were sitting there (or else their jokes were so bad they died). Now it ties in nicely with the earlier verse:

Glad you like the improvement. Alan thought as you do, which is why I changed it.

>>When reading this, it seems as if he is being over dramatic, then by the end of the poem, you realise it is prophetic.

Thanks. He is waking up thrice a night at the moment, in pain because he has stopped breathing (it is a recognised medical condition, apparently). He is concerned that one day he may be too late to wake up.

>>I agree with you that you need at least a comma after discomfort, does it give enough of a pause?

Good question, thanks. I’ll consider that, Nina.

>>I lift things awkwardly - I lifted things awkwardly

Yes, poetically that might be better - does sound a tad bad. I was being literal (his job involves lifting many heavy weights daily and, since his back is bad, his lifting movement is poor. But I shouldn’t let the fact get in the way of the smoothness because the entire poem is not literal so adjusting might be wise. Thank you; I shall think on’t.

>>The line - I told him how they stick a camera down - feels wrong. Either you could leave it out all together:

>>I sympathised;
>>I empathised;
>>I related all my ills.

Sounds better, Nina. No doubt about that.

An interesting idea. I shall think of that. (Would complete Alan’s I emphasis, too). My only reluctance is that, amongst all his angst, pains and discomforts, my telling him about having a camera stuck down into my stomach seemed to worry him most. I told him it was not really very painful and nothing to worry about (I was trying to re-assure him) but I think I scared him to death almost. I would have been fine, too but all they could find for me was one of those old “Grandstand” cameras with four big lenses and a massive wheeled base. So this really was the genesis of the poem and I’m a tad reluctant to drop it.

I sympathised;
I empathised;
I related all my ills.
I told him how they
stick a camera down.

We agreed -
we were falling apart.
Positive entropy:
felt negative to us.

I like this version very much, though... I shall think of that, thanks.

>>Please leave the aches and pains at home when we all meet up and just bring along the dirty jokes. I could do with a laugh (and a few drinks)

LOL, I was only responding to him. I don’t have lots of worries to bring with me; I keep them locked in the whisky cupboard.

>>Just editing to add that I think related works well in this verse. It is a word I often use, in fact I was just typing it now on something which reminded me that I wanted mention it.

Thanks for your excellent suggestions, visit and re-visit. Yes, I use relate simply as an ordinary word every day, too. Never seems unusual to me. I suppose we all speak slightly differently and there are “ordinary” words which I may seldom use. (Like “Bus”) :)

Thanks Nina; appreciated. I shall be re-editing and will go through your suggestions again then.

All the best,
James.

[Guest_Jox_*]

Hi Fran,

>>Well, some of us can look forward to the enjoyment of discussing (or disgusting?) our sore points in the pub in a few weeks time.

There really are so many comments I'd like to make here... :)

Thanks for your visit and comment - I shall be include the idea when mulling-over the next revision.

>>One (tentative - as always) suggestion:
>>Death stood in the corner,
>>tapping his watch.
>>Time gentlemen, please.

It's very clever - I like that; I just wonder if it might be too humourous - lift the piece from being morose? I shall think on't. But I'm glad I've seen it - had me laughing (which might be its undoing).

>>Cheers!
>>Fran

Cheers to you, too.
Thanks Fran,

James.

[Cybele]

Hello James,

Well here I am again, with an entirely different interpretation of your poem.

This would appear to be the norm in the line of pub conversation and reads to me like an excellent example of eavesdropping. For me, there is no angst here, just the usual human condition ~ if we don't converse about the weather or politics, we try to outdo each other with illnesses and operations.

I thought this read through (with your proposed revisions) very smoothly indeed and I have no nits to offer ~ except to say I think Fran's...

"Time Gentlemen Please"

would fit in beautifully. I also like the way you used a different colour for the friend's dialogue. Very effective.

[Guest_Jox_*]

Hi Grace,

Thanks for swanning in and around and offering your crit; much appreciated.

I'm glad you like the colour device. For monochromatic printing a different font could be used or bold / non-bold. For a reading different voices. I just like the uncluttered look which frequent quote marks ruin. (In the ten word snippets I prefer the words not to be highlighted - I find it distracting).

An interesting interpretation - and the two people on the table next to ours, no doubt heard the conversation like that (when they could stop patting my dogs, who lapped it up). So I find your perspective interesting and I wonder if I might write one at an angle - as perceived by others. One day, anyway.

The reason I didn't wish to use Fran's precise words was because this was not meant to be humorous. Her suggestion is brilliant and very funny. However, I have tried to adapt it to be grimmer and I hope you - and Fran - will like my adaptation (I think I was posting it as you posted this).

I wouldn't have brought up illness but the poor chap is very concerned (he's back at the Dr's today - she's checked him once but if no better, today was the re-appointment. We'll have to see what she says. It's probably very minor - muscle strain but it's interesting how talking about such things leads onto potentially more serious problems - i.e. forgetting to breathe. That's quite scary.

Thanks very much, James.

[Guest_Toumai_*]

James,

The revsions are working so well - and I do like the last line: a tad more subtle than my suggestion.

Fran

[Guest_Jox_*]

Hi Fran,

Thanks for popping back.

>>The revsions are working so well - and I do like the last line: a tad more subtle than my suggestion.

Thanks! Glad you like the revisions.

Well, the last line may have been adapted a little to suit the intended mood but it was your idea. Without that, the poem would have still had its flat ending. Thank you very much indeed.

James.

[Cybele]

Hello James,

I had no idea this was a true account. That would have put a whole new slant on it. I know you don't like to elaborate on your work and would rather people reach their own conclusions, but I think in a case like this I would have read this entirely differently and commented more appropriately had I known the facts. perhaps, if you could add one tiny word to say Real or Imagined it would affect the slant readers take on it.

I do hope all is well with your friend and that you are soon back discussing something more interesting ~ like cricket  :wink:  

[Guest_Jox_*]

Hi Grace,

Many of my poems are entirely fictitious; many others firmly based in reality; I usually prefer not to say. I only mentioned it in this one because it was a very quick turn-round (we were in the pub yesterday) and I was explaining why I'd done something in such a way.

I haven't spoken to him today (though I suspect he'll now be sent for tests - having been there, done that and persiled the t-shirt myself). We think it unlikely to be serious - but what do we know? When I had similar symptoms, some years ago and I belittled them, my doctor said "Well, they shoot horses for it." So these things can be exceedingly painful but not dangerous.

I couldn't even watch my insides on the tv monitor at the hospital, as the angle was wrong... so no accounting for the patient there, either! I tried to reassure him that the camera down was ok (not as good as a pint of HSB but better than a holiday at Butlins) but it seemed to terrify him even more. I remember the fear of the unknown but I seem to be as helpful as the medical profession!

But his real concern was this strange condition (it has a name and I've forgotten it) whereby people can just stop breathing in their sleep. That is what really worries him, especially with young children. And he is being investigate for that but it looks as if there may be no known solution.

Anyway, this slice of life from two old codgers examining their medical quirks over a pint (see, no stopping us) amused us. So I thought I'd jot the soap opera down.

We did actually discuss other things not mentioned in the poem; how our businesses are going (or not), how to exploit new markets, the marketing plan for his business. Using video CD brochures and so on. He even booked a table for six at the same place on Saturday. But none of that grabbed me as much. Cricket - I wish. He's a good egg in that he hates football - but a bad one in that he hates cricket, too.

"I think in a case like this I would have read this entirely differently and commented more appropriately had I known the facts."

That's precisely why I don't like saying anything too early, Grace. I want your reaction to the poem and I appreciate that. Alan said similar but I used his initial crit in many ways and am pleased I did. Forgive me, please but I enjoy and appreciate your crits... I keep saying it but I really really really take great interest in different interpretations and I don't wish to restrict those. Tell you what...

I'll try to remember to write "Real or Imagined" above my works if I can. But, of course, they are all real AND imagined... in this one, for example, there was no Mr Death standing by us. That would be just silly - couldn't possibly be fact, could it? Of course not; he was at the bar having a pint of real ale - he didn't want to waste HIS time!

Thanks Grace,

James.

[Ephiny]

Hello James

There's nothing quite like the flow of conversations in pubs, is there?!  You not only wrote about this situation, you made it happen all over again..it's so well-written and vivid and all of the revisions work really well.  I love the way you've described the conversation leading into different tangents, from fairly light to fairly serious, doubts and fears creeping in from time to time..becoming lighter again "against the pub's windows"

But he had more...
At night I wake up,
unable to breathe.
Each time death is
checking his watch.

Death stood too close,
tapping his watch:
ready to call time. these lines are just perfect and the ending is excellent, very clever.

I hope that your friend feels better soon

[Guest_Jox_*]

Hi Lucie,

Thanks for your popping in.

>>I hope that your friend feels better soon

Thanks, Lucie. His pains are thought to be a rumbling apendix - so nasty bust should be ok. His sleep problems are tricker.

>> There's nothing quite like the flow of conversations in pubs, is there?!  You not only wrote about this situation, you made it happen all over again..it's so well-written and vivid and all of the revisions work really well.  I love the way you've described the conversation leading into different tangents, from fairly light to fairly serious, doubts and fears creeping in from time to time..becoming lighter again "against the pub's windows"

Thank you very much, Lucie. I appreciate that - seeme I do get something right, sometimes! :)

>>Death stood too close,
tapping his watch:
ready to call time. these lines are just perfect and the ending is excellent, very clever.

Thank you. The idea for that came straight from Fran... so it just shows how useful being critted can be.

Thanks Lucie!

James.

[Psyche]

Hi Jox !

As usual, I've arrived late at the pub, but I've been more or less following everybody's suggestions and your remarks and revisions, so just wanted to say how significant as well as a little surreal ("pub with no name") your poem is.
Hope there's some booze left over for me...

But mostly I agree with Grace, in that it's a poetised expression of what people actually do talk about when they get together: health, politics and all that.

I thought the camera part should stay, probably because I've just had one put down my own stomach    Not a recommendable past-time, but I was a good girl and it went smoothly and fast. Since we've agreed that health is a worthy subject, I hereby inform whoever's reading, that my stomach's OK, just a little gastritis due to nervous tension and maybe a bug.... have to wait a fortnight for that result...   :(

But he had more...
At night I wake up,
unable to breathe.
Each time death is
checking his watch.

This is perfectly expressed, James, there's nothing worse than waking up at night terrified, heart racing, the feeling that you might be/are dying. Your friend is lucky to have you as a listener. One has to experience that terror to understand it. I don't know what the docs have diagnosed, but these episodes can also be panic attacks, where you just feel you've stopped breathing. It can also be real apnea, which needs treatment as well as TLC.  :)

It didn’t worry me -
before we had children.
I don’t want to die
in my sleep, simply
forgetting to breathe -

Brilliant bit here, including these SO real feelings. This poem is profound and scary. You've had the courage to put into poetry stuff that's usually hush hushed...

watched the snow fall
against the pub’s windows
and passed the time of day.

Love these verses, how you've switched to a sort of melancholy view of the snow, another reality, another way of passing the day, dirty jokes and all.  :pharoah2

Great read, thank you James !
Best,
Sylvia

[Guest_Jox_*]

Sylvia, Hi!

Thanks very much for your extensive comments - I will reply very soon.

James.