Voices should be heard, Act, do not Say ..... Options

[Cleo_Serapis]

Hi all.

First off, let me say this before I post this new debate:
[*]I do not want to hear which party you are
[*]I do not want this to become a personal statement
[*]I DO want this to be a place to voice your opinion, YOUR opinion...

OK, here goes:

"Tis easy enough to be pleasant
when life flows along like a song
but the man worthwhile
is the one who will smile
when everything goes dead wrong."
~Anonymous

I'm sure most everyone reading this thread now knows that our President Bush was re-elected for another 4 year term on Tuesday.

It has been widely publicized that the parties spent more money in this election toward the 'college votes'.  What is surprizing to me is that the last I read, only 17% of the college-aged Americans actually voted! 17%!!!!!!

If they say the future is in the hands of our younger generations, then we must show them how to DO what they SAY and put their money where their mouth is, IMHO. There has been talk of the student demonstrations (picketing the parties they disagree with) etc.. and this will continue in our country. I have no issue with that, after all, here in my country, freedom of speech is a powerful tool & right.

I'm not here to say which party I chose, nor do I wish to hear who your party is, I DO however, want to get a discussion going, regarding the CHOICES that our younger generations should understand.

The following is from "Google" searching 'new selective service legislation' regarding a potential "draft":

Despite denials that the U.S. plans to re-institute the draft, the Pentagon has stepped up preparations for a new Selective Service System that could allow for a full-blown draft by next year.

Every few months Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld gets peppered with the nettlesome question about whether the administration, straining to keep boots on the ground around the globe, is considering reviving the compulsory military service draft – moribund since 1973. The answer is always an unqualified “No.”

Inquiries by NewsMax – and a persistent host of others, says the agency – to the Selective Service System (SSS) about an impending return to the draft are answered as well with an explicit canned denial:

“Notwithstanding recent stories in the news media and on the Internet, Selective Service is not getting ready to conduct a draft for the U.S. Armed Forces – either with a special skills or regular draft.

“Rather, the Agency remains prepared to manage a draft if and when the President and the Congress so direct. This responsibility has been ongoing since 1980 and is nothing new.

“Further, both the President and the Secretary of Defense have stated on more than one occasion that there is no need for a draft for the War on Terrorism or any likely contingency, such as Iraq.

“Additionally, the Congress has not acted on any proposed legislation to reinstate a draft. Therefore, Selective Service continues to refine its plans to be prepared as is required by law, and to register young men who are ages 18 through 25.”

For sure, “The Selective Service System’s Annual Performance Plan for Fiscal Year 2004,” is a document that leaves the careful reader with anything but the impression of a sleepy agency drilling for a fire it knows will never flare.

By early next year, the government will be test firing a mobilization infrastructure of 56 state headquarters, 442 area offices, and 1,980 local boards.

Funding is in the coffers to kick off a rigorous “Area Office Prototype Exercise,” which will “test the activation process from SSS Lottery input to the issuance of First Armed Forces Examination Orders.”

Ramping up is the “Selective Service System’s High School Registrar Program,” a plan to put volunteer registrars in at least 85 percent of the nation’s high schools – an increase from 65 percent in 1998.

At the head of the busy-work list – a no-nonsense commitment to report to the president by March 31st, 2005 that the system is ready to roll full steam within 75 days, which would clear the decks for a first lottery by June 15th, 2005.

Meanwhile, helping the agency to reach its goals and objectives is a little known provision of the No Child Left Behind Act that requires schools to provide contact information for every student – upon pain of losing federal aid dollars...

For the rest of the article, click here: http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2...24/104815.shtml


The eRumor warns that there are two bills before Congress that, if passed, would bring back the military draft and make it mandatory for both boys and girls starting in June, 2005.

The bills, S.89 and H.R.163 are real. But they are not new.

An eRumor started circulating in June, 2004 warning that the draft was only a year away. In reality, these twin bills have existed since 2003 and have never gotten out of committees.

In other words, they are stagnant.

Nobody in Washington seriously expects a draft and certainly not by 2005.

It's known as the "reinstate draft" bill or the "Universal National Service Act of 2003."

The wording of the bill says it is "To provide for the common defense by requiring that all young persons in the United States, including women, perform a period of military service or a period of civilian service in furtherance of the national defense and homeland security, and for other purposes."

It would require U.S. citizens and other residents, both male and female, between the ages of 18 and 26 to serve two years of "national service."

The reason the bills have gotten attention in 2004 is the military actions in Afghanistan, Iraq, and the war on terrorism. There has been debate about troop strength in Iraq and the status of all the U.S. Armed Forces.

The U.S. Selective Service, however, says that despite the Internet stories, the agency is not getting ready to conduct a draft. It says it is ready to do so should the President and Congress decide, but "that responsibility has been ongoing since 1980 and is nothing new."

The Selective Service further says that "...both the President and the Secretary of Defense have stated on more than one occasion that there is no need for a draft for the War on Terrorism or any likely contingency, such as Iraq. Additionally, the Congress has not acted on any proposed legislation to reinstate a draft."

1.) The legislation to reintroduce the draft was initiated in January
of 2003 by Charles Rangel (Dem) and sponsored by the likes of Sheila
Jackson-Lee, Eleanor Holmes Norton, Jesse Jackson Jr. and other
extreme left-wing democrats. In the Senate it was introduced by
retiring Ernest Hollings, also a Democrat. In other words, no
Republicans involved and not even any mid-stream Democrats.  

2.) Two weeks ago the measure was called to a vote and defeated 421-2 in the House. Not even the sponsors voted for it.  

3.) The Bush administration has repeatedly indicated that it is
satisfied with the size of the military.

4.) The Kerry campaign has indicated a need to add divisions and
increase Special Forces by 40,000 (ignoring the fact the SF folks
require about 4-6 years of experience before qualifying for the
specialty.)

5.) The current US military is smaller than it has been since before
WW II.  

6.) The high-tech, all-volunteer force is not easily adaptable to a
conscription system which doesn't have the ability to control
motivation or qualification of the input.  


Any takers on this debate?
~Cleo  

[Guest_Don_*]

I must apologize for breaking the request "I do not want this to become a personal statement."  Following is personal opinion, which is personal statement.  Controversy will be minimized.  Our United States once had the best and brightest in office within President Kennedy's administration.  It demonstrated that educated and brilliant minds may fail as well as anyone.

I shall not unravel the intent of secret vote by revealing where my paper was punched in the voting booth.  However, individuals were punched for reasoning external to party affiliation. As to second term presidents, they normally are lameducks and achieve comparatively little.  FDR—Franklin Roosevelt—would have been no exception without World War II, which saved his reputation from disasterous attempt to pack our Supreme Court.  In short, don't get too excited about what the conservatives may do to the liberals.

I was not aware that only 17% of college students voted.  Keep in mind that it is the young blood in learning institutions around the world that tend to adamantly oppose their currently established government.  It is wonderful that millions of dollars were thrown at U.S. college-age to reverse trend that they don't vote or demonstrate political activism.  Remember, the usual American fix is spend money. If it doesn't work, then spend more.

Selective Service:
I read liberal magazines such as The Atlantic Monthly and Harper's.  I read conservative rags likeNational Review.  I get academic and historical insights from such as The Wilson Quarterly.  I am not too keen on The New York Times or Time, which are touted to be the greatest sources since sliced bread. I shall slice, dice and spread my own, thank you.  

James Fallows is a pretty liberal writer. He wrote, "Will Iran be Next?" in December 2004 issue of The Altantic.  In this same issue is the spector of going to war with Mainland China over Taiwanese politics by Trevor Corson.  Hardly news anymore is the difficulties with North Korea.  Bottom line is our military is a thin rubberband and more global dike leaks may be more than a heroic Dutch boy can plug.

Obviously, reinstating draft is a serious consideration if more youth are needed.  My opinion is such a safety valve is no more than conventional contingency.  The bulk of our military is corporate mercenary.  A high-tech need cannot be quickly filled by conscription.  Vast quantities of security hardware are manufactured in our prisons. Why not worry about increase of required workers garnered by our justice system like China?  Much like the British before us, we maneuver foreigners to fight for our interests.  

Historically each nation begins with a citizen military, and evolves to total dependance upon mercenary replacement as population becomes wealthier and lazier. U.S. is on downhill slope of historical verification.  European Roman Empire was the last to wage war profitably.  Social and economic evolution now makes any war expensive and any government emulating Roman conquest will bankrupt itself.  Be more concerned about poverty than being drafted.

All of the above is thought limited to conventional defense and offense for external protection and politics.  Liberty is word British use in place of U.S. freedom.  What about internal integrity?  The so called war on terror has effectively instilled fear among the sheep for the wolves to pick and choose their next meal at will.  How much freedom/liberty have we already yielded?  Is further regulation and threatened conscription merely more of the fear factor to control and manage population?  

Are educational employees likely to rebuff a system that feeds it?  Do cows cease rushing to the warm barn for feed?  Tentacles of government are everywhere and almost impossible to counter intelligently.  If your congressional representative, as only one of millions, is working full time on issues that you have insignificant time to consider, then the frame of personal liberty/freedom is not yours to craft.

The common threads are what bind a people. If everyone believes in God, for instance, then it is a common bond of trust.  If half the populace wants war and half want peace, then a teeter-totter will cast the outcome.  I was raised on values of western movement from ancient Greece, which was a loose common bondand deconstructionist say is moot.  If 98 percent are afraid to stand on principal, then only 2% will.  Are you ready to take hemlock as Socrates did when the state decides you are unworthy?  Will you have that option?

Perhaps 83% of the seemingly disinterested college-age concluded that it does not matter.  


Just one set of opinions

Don