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Haiku or not, Wizard Award ~ haiku without season |
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Guest_Rosemerta_*
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Jul 1 07, 14:02
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Guest
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Hey there, Terry, It has been interesting reading through all the input this thread has generated. Isn't it fascinating how a few little words can take on several lives? You've received some wonderful suggestions and have not one but several pieces to show from it. I hope you wont mind my tossing in my 2 cents as well since I noticed somewhere that you really wanted to make this a haiku and stick to your original words as best you could. QUOTE (Terocon101 @ Jun 1 07, 16:44 ) Softly so softly you kiss me, I felt it not not upon my skin Haiku and Senryu both have syllable counts of 5-7-5 so you have that part right. The difference is that Haiku strictly involves that from nature while Senryu covers pretty much everything else topic wise. Most romantic poems of of this count would fall under Senryu. Thus you pretty much have to choose between the two. These are the examples I see with your original words to fill each intent: Senryu Softly you kiss me Leaving me wanting more than Void upon my skin
Haiku Soft snowflake kisses Void of cold upon my skin In my summer’s dream I hope this helps, if nothing more than in explaination. I like your revisions just fine. ~~Jackie
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Jul 9 07, 15:39
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 376
Joined: 28-May 07
From: Co. Galway, Ireland
Member No.: 440
Real Name: Terry O C
Writer of: Poetry
Referred By:Ephiny
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QUOTE (Rosemerta @ Jul 1 07, 20:02 ) Hey there, Terry, It has been interesting reading through all the input this thread has generated. Isn't it fascinating how a few little words can take on several lives? You've received some wonderful suggestions and have not one but several pieces to show from it. I hope you wont mind my tossing in my 2 cents as well since I noticed somewhere that you really wanted to make this a haiku and stick to your original words as best you could. QUOTE (Terocon101 @ Jun 1 07, 16:44 ) Softly so softly you kiss me, I felt it not not upon my skin Haiku and Senryu both have syllable counts of 5-7-5 so you have that part right. The difference is that Haiku strictly involves that from nature while Senryu covers pretty much everything else topic wise. Most romantic poems of of this count would fall under Senryu. Thus you pretty much have to choose between the two. These are the examples I see with your original words to fill each intent: Senryu Softly you kiss me Leaving me wanting more than Void upon my skin
Haiku Soft snowflake kisses Void of cold upon my skin In my summer’s dream I hope this helps, if nothing more than in explanation. I like your revisions just fine. ~~Jackie Hi Jakie, Thanks so much for your two edits, really cool the way you've written a haiku and a senyru from the original. I suppose I'll have to call mine a senyru since it deals in human experience. I can live with that. Thanks again, I look forward to interacting with you in the future. Terry
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Terrylight lights light
--Raymond Rosliep "The imagination imitates. It is the critical spirit that creates."--Oscar WildeMM Award Winner
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Jul 21 07, 17:38
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 271
Joined: 21-July 07
From: somewhere twixt 'n' tween
Member No.: 456
Real Name: Sam Richmond
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:N/A
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Hey Terry...
I think when contemplating a new discipline, one should study the accepted variations on the forms then decide on one widely accepted form in that discipline. Haiku, senryu, sonnet or villanell, there are different variations of these and almost every form known. We will have to decide how truly traditional we want our poem to be and then it would save us much time and grief to give a brief description of the form we use.
Most scholars of strict Japanese haiku maintain the 17 sylables, 5-7-5, a reference to season, NO reference to human qualities etc... BUT then there are those who find exception and allow many variations. We will always encounter both persuasions, strict disciplined writers and more permissive folks. It might be advantagous to add a note or a link giving reference to the style we choose.
Personally I feel it is good to learn one, very strict discipline of any form we choose. Once we have learned to do it "proper" then we may wish to experiment.
Very nice work, I won't try to classify it, others have done that better than I could already.
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Values are to integrity as spirit to spirituality ... the one is needed that the other is sustained ~ Sam MM Award Winner
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Jul 22 07, 16:35
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 376
Joined: 28-May 07
From: Co. Galway, Ireland
Member No.: 440
Real Name: Terry O C
Writer of: Poetry
Referred By:Ephiny
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Hi Sam, firstly, it's a pleasure to meet you and welcome I'm sure you will enjoy it here. Thanks for your response and for sharing your opinion with me on the 'proper' and 'traditional' practice of writing. I both agree and totally disagree with with you, "..one should study the accepted variations on the forms then decide on one widely accepted form in that discipline." Why should one choose just 'one' form, or why should it be the 'widely accepted' one?? Each to their own, choose what you like... or don't, whatever. Of course I have begun study of the Japanese short forms..it is a lifetimes task and I relish it. Although I personally do not like to place constraints on myself when it comes to writing or any art-form I experiment with. I still enjoy 'ku's with their abundance of rules and constraints, many of which are very hard to explain and really have to be felt and grasped by the writer. Its a pleasure to discuss this with you and I look forward to reading your offerings and forther interaction. Terry
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Terrylight lights light
--Raymond Rosliep "The imagination imitates. It is the critical spirit that creates."--Oscar WildeMM Award Winner
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Jul 23 07, 04:31
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 271
Joined: 21-July 07
From: somewhere twixt 'n' tween
Member No.: 456
Real Name: Sam Richmond
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:N/A
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Morning Terry;
Part of the point there was in the opening of the sentence:
I think when contemplating a new discipline, one should study the accepted variations on the forms then decide on one widely accepted form in that discipline.
My intent being that one must start somewhere. I usually begin with research and try to learn the history of the form, it's culture, something of the mechanics, something about it's reason, rhythm, or purpose.
Once I have developed an appreciation for the form (or decided I don't like it) then I may "choose" to practice, vary, or abandon as I wish.
Thanks for you reply... I really feel we DO agree.
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Values are to integrity as spirit to spirituality ... the one is needed that the other is sustained ~ Sam MM Award Winner
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Jul 23 07, 09:28
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 19,130
Joined: 2-August 03
From: Southwest New Jersey, USA
Member No.: 6
Real Name: Daniel J Ricketts, Sr.
Writer of: Poetry
Referred By:Lori
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... but I think that others have well noted that 5-7-5 though 'strictly followed' by many American fans of haiku are, strictly speaking, not following the 'strict Japanese' looseness of the form... 'nuff said... and I agree with the need for study into the background and history of a particular form, working with it, and then diciding how YOU want to utilize it to say what you want to say and how you want to say it. In my view, though I appreciate the care and attention that many of our colleagues give to a strict traditional linking, each of us has to give our own voice to these 'instant insights' and 'aha moments' Let's all take a picture of that dewdrop on a morning rose... and VOILA.... we have 50 beautiful snapshots of the same dewdrop... each from a different vantage point, each capturing the light slightly differently... a few of them PORTRAITS of a dewdrop. Write on! deLighting in the process, Daniel
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Jul 23 07, 13:56
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 376
Joined: 28-May 07
From: Co. Galway, Ireland
Member No.: 440
Real Name: Terry O C
Writer of: Poetry
Referred By:Ephiny
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Hey Daniel, Yeah, I think we're all in mutual agreement with only slight deviations on this topic. Aren't those 'slight deviations' controversial though?? Just like the slight differences between various religions and the resulting holy wars Daniel said:: "Let's all take a picture of that dewdrop on a morning rose... and VOILA.... we have 50 beautiful snapshots of the same dewdrop... each from a different vantage point, each capturing the light slightly differently... a few of them PORTRAITS of a dewdrop. " Thats a great idea Daniel, I wonder if we could put it to one of the moderators? It could be a weekly Acropolis challenge or something. There's a name for it too where you write a haiku/senryu to couple a short paragraph of prose. Whats it called?? Haibin, I think, not sure. (just done a bit of research, its called haibun) eg, (quoting from your post) "that dewdrop on a morning rose... " I might reply: a summer sunrise- in dewdrops a red rose Just playing a bit with 'rose' and 'rise' there. LOL Anyway, having fun with your stimulus
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Terrylight lights light
--Raymond Rosliep "The imagination imitates. It is the critical spirit that creates."--Oscar WildeMM Award Winner
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Sep 27 07, 03:54
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 181
Joined: 13-September 07
From: Conway, Arkansas
Member No.: 468
Real Name: Pamela
Writer of: Poetry
Referred By:self
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Yes! Yes! YES!!! Terry your 4th revision is superlative! Exquisitly succinct. Vibrant and alive with wonderful evocative imagery! In this case you have proven beyond any shadows that less is more. Superior haiku that I found delightful and enchanting! Perfection! Blessings, Pami
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A relaxed attitude, and a heart of gratitude, increases life whilst joy doth exude! <:))))><
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Sep 27 07, 07:23
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 376
Joined: 28-May 07
From: Co. Galway, Ireland
Member No.: 440
Real Name: Terry O C
Writer of: Poetry
Referred By:Ephiny
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Hi Pami, I have to say I'm happy with that response, well my vainity certainly is, LOL. This was such a great experience to write, my first workshopped haiku, the results can be great, as long as one remembers who the author is, and isnt afraid to stay the course. Thank-you so much for your words and more-so for the energy that they have given me. Best wishes .
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Terrylight lights light
--Raymond Rosliep "The imagination imitates. It is the critical spirit that creates."--Oscar WildeMM Award Winner
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Sep 27 07, 08:18
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 181
Joined: 13-September 07
From: Conway, Arkansas
Member No.: 468
Real Name: Pamela
Writer of: Poetry
Referred By:self
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You're so very welcome Terry...this modern formatted haiku gave me great pleasure! What do you mean by workshopped? Are there classes here? I've not quite got the hang of navigating, but I'm working on it...lol.
::Smiles:: Pami
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A relaxed attitude, and a heart of gratitude, increases life whilst joy doth exude! <:))))><
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Nov 4 07, 10:43
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Mosaic Master
Group: Administrator
Posts: 18,892
Joined: 1-August 03
From: Massachusetts
Member No.: 2
Real Name: Lori Kanter
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:Imhotep
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Congrats Terry on your wizard award winning tile! Well done! ~Cleo
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"It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step into the Road, and if you don't keep your feet, there is no knowing where you might be swept off to." ~ J.R.R Tolkien, The Lord of the RingsCollaboration feeds innovation. In the spirit of workshopping, please revisit those threads you've critiqued to see if the author has incorporated your ideas, or requests further feedback from you. In addition, reciprocate with those who've responded to you in kind. "I believe it is the act of remembrance, long after our bones have turned to dust, to be the true essence of an afterlife." ~ Lorraine M. KanterNominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here! "Worry looks around, Sorry looks back, Faith looks up." ~ Early detection can save your life.MM Award Winner
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