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RESERVATION |
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Jan 25 05, 20:37
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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TOTALLY REVISED, THANKS TO HELP FROM ALL YOU GENEROUS PEOPLE.
RESERVATION
Sunset coils around steppes, a sinister red snake scalding a path between escarpments and sensual drool of river. Egged on by lusty moans of breezes, summer air has a viscous taste, as if fork-tongued vipers were emptying glands of venom: unchecked violence under dome of despair.
Grappling forms etched against toilet-bowl sky, gusts pawing at naked thighs; invasive light bares fangs of thistles, like hordes of skeletons sidling up gaunt shoulders of rock.
Scrub shines bone-sharp in vermilion light, revealing harshness of a Republic, loutish dealings, enforced return of this land’s rightful lineage to encompassing dust of steppes, to piercing thorns, hissed across flatlands by myriad spent sunsets.
Procreation of days and nights, enervating sounds, outrageous confinement hidden from civilization’s dull eyes. Summer light, slithering behind horizons, leaps over wasted women, mockery pealing in their ears: bloated bodies delivered into bondage, until years of fertility become a memory.
Crucifixion of a people awaiting dayspring.
By Psyche.
(Overcrowding, alcohol, illness & despair in reservations, camps, salt-wastes, etc., of Patagonia)
Copyright Sylvia Maclagan, Buenos Aires, Argentina, 2005.
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Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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Guest__*
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Jan 26 05, 05:29
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Dear Sylvia,
I was going to comment, but I do not feel qualified - I'm a man ....
Love Alan
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Guest_Jox_*
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Jan 26 05, 06:14
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Guest
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Hi Sylvia,
This poem, despite its theme is full of life and vigour. I don't have time to offer all the crit I wish to so please don't reply to this yet - I'll re-edit it later.
PROCREATION
Sunset coiled around the steppes like a sinister red snake, burning a path between escarpments and the sensual drool of a river, egged on by the lusty moans of breezes.
(verse split?)
The air had a viscous taste, as if some fork-tongued viper had emptied its glands of venom meant only for unholy mating in the dead of night.
(Two proximate snake metaphors are a tad confusing)
A man struggled with a woman brutishly, their forms etched against a chamber-pot sky,
(I find a "chamber pot sky" to be amusing - not the effect which you intended, methinks. There is a deep-SEATED link between chamber pots and humour in the british PSYCHE! I'm not even sure what you meant to mean with "chamber pot sky".)
draughts pawing at their naked thighs.
(Draughts makes me think of the counters with which one plays the board game, draughts. May I suggest breezes or some such?)
Invasive light bared the fangs of thistles that sidled like horny skeletons up gaunt shoulders of rock.
(Fangs - third snake metaphor... becomming v confusing).
The scrub shone bone-sharp in vermilion light, revealing the dumbness of the land and the unanswerable riddle of females exhausted by loveless mating.
(Why is it a riddle?)(Verse split here too?)
An unforgiving return of their lineage to the encompassing dust of steppes, to piercing thorns, was screamed across flatlands by a million spent sunsets.
Yet the eternal procreation of days and nights brimmed with enervating sounds from lush breeding grounds, hidden from the woman’s sluggish eyes.
(Verse split, maybe?)
The sunset leaped over her, crashing behind the horizon as its laughter pealed in her ears: she would deliver her bloated body into bondage… year after snarling year.
Hi Sylvia - might sound as if I don't like this poem from the comments. Such is not so. I have been focussing on my "corrections" but I haven't finished and there is much to commend here too... I'll be back.
James.
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Jan 26 05, 11:31
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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Hi Fran !
I had already done some editing of my own in the dead of night, talking with my pillow, I mean
Thank you so much for your highly useful comments. I'm relieved you appreciate the "snake" visualizations and mention "biblical". That's OK, because I've added a footnote to explain about the wicked mythological snake of the Mapuche dwellers of Patagonia. It is indeed a mystical and/or mythological reference, as well as having sexual connotations according to people as far apart as St. Augustine and Freud.... !!!! Snakes are found in many religions, creeds, etc. Sorry about the lack of clarity of some of my poems !! They belong in a certain context. My Patagonian collection has a Preface and a Glossary. I believe the footnotes will go at the end, don't know yet
This is actually a totally new poem that I may add on, we'll see.
Thank you for pointing out "draughts", I've changed it to "gusts", hope it sounds better. I'll see where I can include "slither".
I am not sure about the 'feminist' sub-title. It is a story of victimisation. Often victims are women. But some can rise thru the bleakest situations and show inner strength beyond that of any man.
Perhaps I should change the subtitle to "victimization" (Don't know how to go about it... ). But believe me, women and unwanted babes are by far the most victimized people on earth, followed by oldsters. This is not exclusive to poor, marginal societies. Curiously, both my daughter and stepdaughter work with abused (often sexually abused) children and their mothers. Diana in Patagonia, Argentina; and Ale in Spokane, USA. Their descriptions are hair-raising, hearbreaking, and there are few signs of improvement, whatever the neighbourhood.
I'll see about chamber-pot... it's indeed humorous, but I intended it as black humor. Even the sky is er... like an upside-down excremental vessel... help !
Yes, I want this poem to be disturbing. Thanks a lot for your comments, Fran, best, Psyche
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Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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Jan 26 05, 11:45
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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Hi Alan ! I see no reason for you to be unqualified, as a father and man, to comment on victimisation. But I'm very grateful that you went down that road anyway :D ??? Have you any idea how I can remove the subtitle from my poem? Or change it? Thanks a lot, Alan, love, Sylvia
:) :)
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Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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Jan 26 05, 11:56
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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Hi there James !
Thanks for scrutinizing my poem so carefully. I already edited some bits due to a conversation with my pillow, but haven't removed the "amusing" chamber-pot, as yet. Let me try the seat for size a while longer :jester:
I've exchanged draughts for gusts, as Fran and you rightly pointed out the difficulties.
Will return to see about the verse splits, I think they're a good idea, thank you.
Must rush off to attend chores (victimisation??? :jester: )
Best, Sylvia
······· ·······
Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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Jan 26 05, 12:39
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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Hi again, Fran ! Found a place for "slither", thank you so much ! Have done a lot of editing, removed several adjectives Hope it's a little better (it's a bun just out of the oven, ya know... ) Best, Sylvia
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Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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Guest_Jox_*
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Jan 26 05, 13:29
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Guest
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Hi Sylvia,
Sorry! My delay caught me out there - I can't continue that crit because you've already changed some things.
The verse splits - yes, please consider that.
The chamber pot would be a disaster for a British audience because it is an object of such mirth and ridicule here. What did you mean by that phrase, please? I see what you mean about being humorous but I think that fits ill with the poem - I think the point that even the heavens look Sh.. is best made seriously - I don't think this is a poem into which humour can successfully be injected. I believe it will undermine it too much.
Don't worry about removing the sub-title from this posting's heading - but I agree with Alan that I wouldn't use it again: acts as a barrier to some and a certain expectation-raiser to others; best let people think for themselves. I would not change the sub-title to "victimisation" etc - you poem should be (and is) good enough to stand on its own... no need to instruct the audience.
I take Fran's point that women don't want to be labelled as victims but also her implied point that it isn't always women. You poem is about women and that's absolutely fine - but it is (and has to be) an incomplete picture of victimisation. So leave it as a precise spotlight on one particular aspect.
Dismissing "draughts" was good. (I think Americans call the game "Chequers" by the way).
I still think your "unanswerable riddle" is strange - do you mean as in a Catch 22 situation - a complex situation where victims cannot pull themselves out? Riddle sounds very Sherlock Holmes; very intriguing. You want (I think) sympathy for their plight; not puzzle-solving.
Hope this helps a little and that I have understood much.
If you're going to use that snake so often, why not thread him throughout each verse? As is looks a little indecisive??
All the best, James.
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Guest_Nina_*
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Jan 26 05, 15:36
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Guest
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Hi Sylvia
Like Fran, I feel this poem evokes in me a strange mixture of sensuality, venom and revulsion. Also I am left uncertain as to whether the women are willing participants or being used and abused. Certainly their bodies are being abused by constant pregnancy. Interestingly, though your piece is set in Patagonia, it would have been the same story for women all over the world before contraception was easily available especially among the poorer communities. Women worn out and old before their time because of constant pregnancy, poor diet, poor sanitation and disease.
Nina
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Jan 27 05, 12:14
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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QUOTE(Nina @ Jan. 26 2005, 17:36) Hi Sylvia
Like Fran, I feel this poem evokes in me a strange mixture of sensuality, venom and revulsion. Also I am left uncertain as to whether the women are willing participants or being used and abused. Certainly their bodies are being abused by constant pregnancy. Interestingly, though your piece is set in Patagonia, it would have been the same story for women all over the world before contraception was easily available especially among the poorer communities. Women worn out and old before their time because of constant pregnancy, poor diet, poor sanitation and disease.
Nina Hi Nina !
Your comments are so welcome, always. How wonderful to learn how other people "receive" one's stumbling efforts... 1. The sensual, revulsive part (though not actually planned), has to do with an integration of landscape and human acts that I guess I learned along the way, from different readings. One always picks up a little here and there, and then suddenly it all comes out and surprises even oneself. I've always been impressed by the great writers who used Nature to reflect or emphasize humankind's repulsive actions, from Greek drama (i.e., Antigone), thru' Shakespeare (Lear, Macbeth, etc.), to Thomas Hardy (impressive!!!) and the more modern "Cold Comfort Farm", by Stella Gibbons. It's as if Nature becomes awesome, terrifying or plain revulsive (Cold Comfort Farm), when the people in that corner of the planet act in a perverse or cruel fashion. Usually, Nature returns to her beauty and calmness when the "wrongs" are righted or Time flows by... Anyway, that's what I've humbly attempted with "my" corner of the globe, Patagonia. It is indeed an extremely beautiful region, but, personally, I can't stomach the injustices that are committed and the devastation of the land. Therefore I sometimes paint the land as being harsh and cruel, as Nature certainly can be. There is a "shadow" to everything, isn't there? 2. You make a good point about the uncertainty of the woman's attitude towards abuse. I have seen depths of despair and apathy among people, where taking care of one's own body appears to be too hard a task. It's a matter of utter depression and desolation, not of preservatives and sanitation. Teennage pregnancies are often through lack of love and family support, which leads to self-abandon and apathy. Hardly a cry for help, more like a void... By the way, I'm talking about actual reality, not sometime in the past. These things are happening in about 2/3 of the globe right now....sorry !! Nina, I appreciate your help enormously, thanks again, Psyche
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Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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Jan 27 05, 12:23
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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Hi James ! Have read your comments with great interest and will be back asap. Duty calls in the kitchen !! The editing will have to wait until some bellies have been filled.... Thanks again, Psyche
······· ·······
Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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Jan 28 05, 03:17
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Group: Gold Member
Posts: 3,660
Joined: 23-August 03
From: Somerset, England
Member No.: 22
Real Name: Grace
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
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Good morning Sylvia,
I think the emotions I derived from this desolate poem were savagery, cruelty, raw sexuality and an overwhelming sadness for the human condition.
That is not to say that I didn't like the poem. On the contrary, this is so strong it screams out for attention to the plight of such poor people.
It is a Great poem Sylvia.
These lines are brilliant..
burning a path between escarpments and the sensual drool of a river, egged on by the lusty moans of breezes.
They set such a sensual scene, leading into the brutalisation of this woman, making the reader feel like a peeping Tom.
You are unique in expressing the misery and suffering of these people and showing their plight to the world.
Keep on championing their cause, Sylvia. One day the world just might listen. If not, it certainly wasn't for the want of your trying my friend.
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Guest__*
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Jan 28 05, 05:02
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Guest
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Dear Sylvia,
Thank you for the reassurances !
I was rather taken aback by what I saw as the overly "feminist" agenda of the poem, and perhaps its similarities to the sisterhood's rants.
But I see from your replies that that is possibly a side-effect of your true message.
As to how to remove, I think you'll need Cleo for that !
Love Alan
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Guest_Jox_*
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Jan 28 05, 05:15
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Guest
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MM Security: Cleo removes feminists? Could cause uproar
James.
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Feb 9 05, 12:03
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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QUOTE(Jox @ Jan. 28 2005, 07:15) MM Security: Cleo removes feminists? Could cause uproar
James. HA HA JAMES !!! Indeed, I do not know who changed the sub-title for me, better let the MM hacker keep a low profile, for safety's sake. I shall certainly think twice about subtitles in future. You're right ! Sylvia
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Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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Feb 9 05, 13:39
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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Hi James !
I've finally gotten down to editing the poem. Put verse splits as you suggested. Also removed some articles and chiselled down one or two lines. Thanks a lot for your valuable assistance !
Haven't changed "riddle" because in my book it's an ancient term used for profound questions, i.e., the riddle posed to Oedipus by the Sphynx !
a complex situation where victims cannot pull themselves out?
Right ! Old Oedipus gained only passing glory by guessing the riddle. In that sense, riddles are "unanswerable", since they don't solve the existential problem.
I don't care whether it's used in a more superficial fashion nowadays. Yes, if you like, it's a Catch-22 situation; that book expressed ghastly events matter-of-factly, with shocking effect.
I'm not expressing sympathy, I'm describing things.
The other problem, posed by the "chamber-pot sky", has been resolved by an even worse metaphor, as you may see. I propose to emulate Stella Gibbons with this poem. It's purposely an admixture of tragicomic images, with exaggeration as a prime poetic recourse. Sorry !! (not for everybody's taste, I admit...). :(
All the same, you'll see that I've followed your advice and done plenty of editing. Thank you so much, James !!
Psyche :wave:
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Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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Feb 9 05, 13:52
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Ornate Oracle
Group: Praetorian
Posts: 8,870
Joined: 27-August 04
From: Bariloche, Argentine Patagonia
Member No.: 78
Real Name: Sylvia Evelyn Maclagan
Writer of: Poetry & Prose
Referred By:David Ting
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Hi Cybele !
At last I've reached the editing part of my job here. Way behind in everything !!
I'm very glad that you find this poem digestible, since it was subconsciously meant to be very in-digestible... :speechless:
I think the emotions I derived from this desolate poem were savagery, cruelty, raw sexuality and an overwhelming sadness for the human condition. That is not to say that I didn't like the poem. On the contrary, this is so strong it screams out for attention to the plight of such poor people.
Yes, that's exactly what I think I was trying to achieve. You've put it into rational speech for me, Grace. Sadly, the world we live in calls for "screaming out for attention", as you so well put it.
Whew... I value your judgement so very much, Grace. Thank you for dropping by and allowing me to shriek with fury now and then !
I'm afraid I shall not be able to offer crits of others' work until tomorrow. Family is visiting !!
Hugs, Psyche :wave:
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Mis temas favoritos The Lord replied, my precious, precious child, I love you and I would never leave you. During your times of trial and suffering, when you see only one set of footprints, it was then that I carried you.
"There is no life higher than the grasstops Or the hearts of sheep, and the wind Pours by like destiny, bending Everything in one direction."
Sylvia Plath, Crossing the Water, Wuthering Heights. Nominate a poem for the InterBoard Poetry Competition by taking into careful consideration those poems you feel would best represent Mosaic Musings. For details, click into the IBPC nomination forum. Did that poem just captivate you? Nominate it for the Faery award today! If perfection of form allured your muse, propose the Crown Jewels award. For more information, click here!MM Award Winner
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